Watch: Aviation faces inflection point as climate challenge looms

Description:

Joel Makower interviews Annie Petsonk on aviation's urgent need to mitigate emissions.

Title: Annie Petsonk Transcript

Duration: 5:52 minutes

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The Shell™ pecten logo appears, then fades. A three dimensional model of Earth rotates while white silhouettes of planes fly across the globe. On the right side of the screen, a shot of Annie Petsonk talking with no audio.

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Flightpath: Navigating the Route to Sustainable Aviation

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This episode

Aviation faces inflection point as climate challenge looms beyond COVID-19

{Joel Makower sits onscreen. Facing him is Annie Petsonk. The camera alternates between speakers.}

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Joel Makower

Executive Editor

GreenBiz.com

Joel Makower:

I'm Joel Makower. We're talking about what it will take to make aviation sustainable with Annie Petsonk, International Counsel at the Environmental Defense Fund.

Joel Makower:

How would you describe the state of aviation sustainability today?

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Annie Petsonk

International Counsel

Environmental Defense Fund

Annie Petsonk:

I think airlines have tried to make some commitments towards sustainability. They're beginning to look at sustainable alternative fuels. But the scale and tempo of those changes are nowhere sufficient to meet the climate challenge.

Now, in the era of COVID and climate change, the leaders in the industry need to seize this opportunity as an inflection point, and transform aviation into an instrument of sustainability.

Joel Makower:

Talk a little bit more about EDF's Net Zero initiative. What is it doing to help companies get to where they need to go, further, faster?

Annie Petsonk:

First, the companies are setting internal goals for getting to net zero, and even becoming net reducers of emissions on ambitious timetables. Their goals include their so-called scope three or travel emissions.

The second thing they're doing is sharing, learning with each other, and with other companies, on how to achieve this enormous challenge of the transformation to net zero.

Joel Makower:

So in your conversations with airlines, what do you get the sense that's driving them to take on these initiatives?

Annie Petsonk:

There are three factors. The first is the impact of climate change itself. The hot days that climate change is causing means that, on the hottest days, airplanes simply can't take off. There's not enough lift. Runway's too hot.

The second is their customers. Customers are beginning to demand climate action from airlines in two ways. First, young people, following the Greta Thunberg's lead, have followed the flight shame movement.

But more importantly, in my book, corporate customers are following that same lead. Companies, as I mentioned, have taken on important climate change commitments. And they're starting to ask their airlines, "How are you going to help me reduce my scope three or travel related carbon emissions?" During the pandemic, corporate customers, they're simply not flying.

Annie Petsonk:

If airlines want to entice those road warrior corporate customers back onto planes, they're going to have to show that they're actually moving fast to help those corporate customers help meet their climate commitments.

The third factor that's starting to impinge on airlines is Wall Street. We see a growing movement among investors, looking for sustainability, proof of sustainability among companies.

Joel Makower:

What actions or strategies do you recommend that airlines undertake?

Annie Petsonk:

It's got to come from the top, Joel. We really see the need for leadership of airlines to really think about and embrace ambitious climate goals.

The airlines that move first to put an internal price on carbon will be the ones that find it advantageous to make investments today, in things like light-weighting. Every ounce of weight you save on the aircraft saves fuel, saves money, and saves emissions.

Joel Makower:

Who's going to pay for all this?

Annie Petsonk:

Sustainable aviation fuel is the big one that the airlines would really like to crack. [T]he price differential between jet fuel and truly sustainable aviation fuel is very large.

What we think is needed is a joint effort involving governments, the airlines, and their largest customers, to develop innovative financial instruments and government support, to bridge the gap between conventional jet fuel and sustainable aviation fuel.

Joel Makower:

What's the role of offsets here? Where do they fit in?

Annie Petsonk:

We think there are high quality offsets out there. We think they can play a very important role, if they're done right.

Joel Makower:

What does it mean for an offset to be high quality?

Annie Petsonk:

Several things. First, it has to be well measured. And since an offset is earned by reducing emissions below what would have otherwise happened, you have to do a pretty good job of figuring out what would have otherwise happened.

You also need to track that offset credit throughout its lifetime, to make sure that no one else is claiming credit for those same reductions.

The third thing that I think is important to stress about offsets is that emission reduction investments can be really important, not only in reducing carbon emissions, but reducing emissions of other pollutants. And so companies that are interested in using offsets to offset their aviation emissions, I think should look preferentially at the social and equity benefits of those offsets.

Joel Makower:

When you look at what it takes to make aviation sustainable through the lens of the entire aviation industry ecosystem, who's not at the table that needs to be?

Annie Petsonk:

First, local communities. I think back to my dad's biplane in the little airport in Pennsylvania in a cornfield, and the farmers around the airport aren't at the table. They have an ability to provide a more sustainable aviation fuel if we can get it right. Local communities across the United States could be providing more sustainable aviation fuel. You see things like municipal garbage we could turn into aviation fuel. Overstocked forests in the Western United States, which are tinder kegs now, we could be taking out those dead trees and turning that dead wood into sustainable aviation fuel.

Joel Makower:

When we look out a few years at the aviation technology roadmap, we see a lot of promising technologies, electrification being one of the main ones. How much should we be looking to those as the solution to aviation sustainability challenges?

Annie Petsonk:

Electric flight there maybe useful, particularly for short haul journeys.

But for long haul aviation, I think that changes to the design of the aircraft to improve the aircraft, so that sustainable aviation fuels with little to no carbon impact, climate impact, can be put into the aircraft. I think those will be important.

Joel Makower:

 [W]hat keeps you up at night about aviation sustainability?

Annie Petsonk:

I worry most, frankly, that the airline CEOs are understandably preoccupied with the bottom line for their companies and, with trying to protect the jobs. But if they don't move to tackle the climate crisis and put it at the core of their rebuilding from COVID, then the risk is that aviation will rebuild from COVID only to be confronted with the climate crisis and another dramatic reduction in flying that leaves jobs stranded.

Joel Makower:

What keeps you hopeful?

Annie Petsonk:

The people I know who work in the sector, who understand the science of climate change, understand the need to move swiftly to tackle the climate crisis. The people who are working outside the sector, but driving innovation in alternative fuels, in reducing emissions in the carbon markets to generate offset credits. Those give me inspiration and help me believe that we can together get this done, that working together, local communities with airports, airlines, and major customers and governments, we can together get this done.

Joel Makower:

Thank you, Annie.

Annie Petsonk:

Thanks Joel